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Hipro HP-D3057F3H Review

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Re: Hipro HP-D3057F3H Review

Postby LongRunner » August 29th, 2013, 4:56 am

Not directly related (it's another page on that site), but I thought it would be worth mentioning:

Speaking of clean-up, I have finally had confirmation of something I had always expected would be the case. I was contacted by someone from a European lighting manufacturer with some scary information (I don't want to be too specific about his job function lest he lose his job for speaking out).

He has visited Chinese factories where CFLs are made, and tells me that mercury spillage is common during the manufacturing process, and that the workers have zero protective clothing, masks or anything else to safeguard their health. This means (as many could easily have predicted) that while our environment may benefit by using CFLs, the Chinese environment and factory workers most certainly do not.

:eek:

By the way, I think it's about time to replace the old fittings, if you're going to leave incandescent lighting in the past. BC and ES are complete relics, with totally inadequate safety (if the bulb is removed, you can reach the contacts with your fingers. Enough said).

It seems that as far as many manufacturers are concerned, melted plastic, evil-smelling smoke and other similar issues are considered normal modes of failure at the end-of-life of a CFL.

I'm horrified. They should never have made "drop-in" replacements for incandescent lamps.
Information is far more fragile than the HDDs it's stored on. Being an afterthought is no excuse for a bad product.

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Re: Hipro HP-D3057F3H Review

Postby LongRunner » August 29th, 2013, 10:58 pm

Continue CFL discussion here.
Information is far more fragile than the HDDs it's stored on. Being an afterthought is no excuse for a bad product.

My PC: Core i3 4130 on GA‑H87M‑D3H with GT640 OC 2GiB and 2 * 8GiB Kingston HyperX 1600MHz, Kingston SA400S37120G and WD3003FZEX‑00Z4SA0, Pioneer BDR‑209DBKS and Optiarc AD‑7200S, Seasonic G‑360, Chenbro PC31031, Linux Mint Cinnamon 20.3.
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Re: Hipro HP-D3057F3H Review

Postby c_hegge » August 29th, 2013, 11:07 pm

I was going to say that the CFL discussion was for another thread. I would have split the thread if it had continued here.
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Re: Hipro HP-D3057F3H Review

Postby LongRunner » September 17th, 2013, 10:03 pm

The Schottky rectifiers on the +3.3V, +5V and +5VSB outputs in this PSU are 60V rated. This is actually detrimental to efficiency since higher-voltage Schottky diodes have higher voltage drops. And what would you need them for in a forward converter???
Information is far more fragile than the HDDs it's stored on. Being an afterthought is no excuse for a bad product.

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Re: Hipro HP-D3057F3H Review

Postby Wester547 » September 18th, 2013, 12:31 pm

You mean you have the same power supply and are figuring out that it has Ultrafasts on the +12V rail/60V rated Schottkys otherwise/etc? I ask because to my knowledge, even small revisions of power supplies can have slight variations, and the Schottkys in yours might be slightly different than c_hegge's (just maybe).
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Re: Hipro HP-D3057F3H Review

Postby LongRunner » September 18th, 2013, 9:47 pm

The ultra-fasts are on +12V, the 60V Schottkys on +3.3V, +5V, and +5VSB.

As an example of higher-PRV Schottkys having higher forward voltage drops, let's look at MOSPEC S20Cxx (which spans 30V to 100V):

At 25°C:
30~45PRV: 0.55V
50~60PRV: 0.70V
70~80PRV: 0.75V
90~100PRV: 0.85V

At 100°C:
30~45PRV: 0.48V
50~60PRV: 0.60V
70~80PRV: 0.68V
90~100PRV: 0.78V

High-voltage Schottky rectifiers, such as Cree CSD06060, have higher voltage drops than fast recovery diodes, but retain the Schottky advantage of instant recovery.

Higher-voltage fast-recovery (including ultra-fast) rectifiers have a different problem - the reverse recovery time increases with increasing voltage.

FR101~FR104: 150ns
FR105: 250ns
FR106~FR107: 500ns

(The voltage ratings are the same sequence as for 1N4001~1N4007: 50, 100, 200, 400, 600, 800, 1000)

There isn't any problem that I'm aware of with higher-voltage standard rectifiers (used for low-frequency applications, such as linear power supplies) (e.g. 1N4001~1N4007, 2A01~2A07, 1N5400~1N5408, 6A05~6A10). (But above 1000PRV, you need multiple diodes in series, and it's pretty obvious what that means...)
Information is far more fragile than the HDDs it's stored on. Being an afterthought is no excuse for a bad product.

My PC: Core i3 4130 on GA‑H87M‑D3H with GT640 OC 2GiB and 2 * 8GiB Kingston HyperX 1600MHz, Kingston SA400S37120G and WD3003FZEX‑00Z4SA0, Pioneer BDR‑209DBKS and Optiarc AD‑7200S, Seasonic G‑360, Chenbro PC31031, Linux Mint Cinnamon 20.3.
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+5VSB capacitor failure theory (for this and related units)

Postby LongRunner » October 25th, 2013, 5:26 pm

The ripple measured at the output of +5VSB may be low enough, but what about that before the coil???

The coil and the capacitor after it basically "divide", if you like, the ripple entering the coil. (I had a formula here before, but as it turns out, I was wrong.)

I don't know the specs of the coil Hipro used but Digi-Key stocks one rated at 10µH. As the VIPer22A used switches at 60kHz nominal and the 470µF 10V Teapo SC used after the coil has a nominal ESR of 0.12Ω, the divison ratio with my chosen inductor is approximately 31:1. This means that the ripple voltage on the 1000µF capacitor before the coil could be >200mV while keeping the output ripple in spec, stressing the already unreliable original capacitor and causing it to fail in short order.

The 1000µF 6.3V Teapo SC (their datasheet doesn't show the exact model used by Hipro) is rated for only 0.67A (though, to be fair, the Nichicon HE replacements you use are good for a bit more (0.84A)). For improved long-term reliability, I would recommend using a higher grade replacement - a 1200µF Panasonic FR (good for 1.24A) should do.
Last edited by LongRunner on March 5th, 2014, 10:01 am, edited 1 time in total.
Information is far more fragile than the HDDs it's stored on. Being an afterthought is no excuse for a bad product.

My PC: Core i3 4130 on GA‑H87M‑D3H with GT640 OC 2GiB and 2 * 8GiB Kingston HyperX 1600MHz, Kingston SA400S37120G and WD3003FZEX‑00Z4SA0, Pioneer BDR‑209DBKS and Optiarc AD‑7200S, Seasonic G‑360, Chenbro PC31031, Linux Mint Cinnamon 20.3.
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Re: Hipro HP-D3057F3H Review

Postby c_hegge » October 25th, 2013, 5:51 pm

It is possible that ripple does contribute to the failure. Interestingly Hipro use NCC KY interchangeably with Teapo SC on these units. I've seen one which had KY on the 5vsb, and Nichicon HM for the 3.3V output, and Teapo SC elsewhere. The Japanese caps were fine, but the Teapos on the 12V had failed.
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Re: Hipro HP-D3057F3H Review

Postby LongRunner » October 25th, 2013, 6:21 pm

Aside from having Japanese capacitors on the standby output and Taiwanese ones on the main outputs, there's another way the main output capacitors could fail first - leaving the PC on most of the time, as opposed to shutting it down when you're not using it.
Information is far more fragile than the HDDs it's stored on. Being an afterthought is no excuse for a bad product.

My PC: Core i3 4130 on GA‑H87M‑D3H with GT640 OC 2GiB and 2 * 8GiB Kingston HyperX 1600MHz, Kingston SA400S37120G and WD3003FZEX‑00Z4SA0, Pioneer BDR‑209DBKS and Optiarc AD‑7200S, Seasonic G‑360, Chenbro PC31031, Linux Mint Cinnamon 20.3.
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Re: Hipro HP-D3057F3H Review

Postby c_hegge » October 25th, 2013, 7:18 pm

That's possible, but the PC wasn't all that old (only 3 years IIRC). They still shouldn't have failed as soon as they did.
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